trashcansinatras.com recently talked to Frank Reader and John Douglas about what’s happening with the band, recent events (in and out of TCS,) and their plans for the future. Next time, we’ll seek to catch up with Paul, Stephen and Davy. For now, though, let’s turn it over to Frank and John.
trashcansinatras.com: TCS has recently done four gigs — Glasgow, Edinburgh and two in London. After five years off in the UK, what was it like trodding the boards again? The attendees we've heard from all had a blast at the shows. How did things go for the band?
frank: Pretty good… Glasgow, especially, was a great night in terms of the overall atmosphere, but it was also a wee bit nerve wracking… There was real ‘air of expectancy,’ and the end result was we ended up playing some of the songs about three times as fast as they’re intended… The Glasgow gig got a couple of good write-ups in the [Glasgow] newspapers. It was treated as an actual ‘news item,’ rather than an arts review. Maybe they couldn’t believe we were actually playing a show…
trashcansinatras.com: The crowd was quite into it, I’m guessing…
frank: Yeah, but Glasgow audiences have always been kind of aggressive... It was a very festive atmosphere, but I could hear people shouting "knob" at me. They paid ten pounds to come in and shout "knob" at me. It’s a Scottish thing…
john: Glasgow was definitely the most nerve wracking… Our first show in ages... It’s always a little bit edgier in Glasgow — we wanted to be at our best, so we tried staying sober and it worked as far as playing the songs went, but strangely the gig still flew by in a sweaty, feedback-drenched haze…
It felt fantastic to have Mr. Hughes back on stage... full strength Trash Cans. Edinburgh was as Edinburgh always is — a little bit stand offish. Mind you, it was a Monday night. We were pretty relaxed compared to Glasgow and there was a tangibly warm mood… Frank was in fine form...I think we played well, too. London... both nights were enjoyable. We met up with some old friends and played them some new tunes and generally started to feel good about playing again. Even lugging the amps was alright. We were given a hand by some commandos — not an every day event.
trashcansinatras.com: TCS has recently come up with some new material and it's sounding great. From your own perspective, how, if at all, has the songwriting process changed from, say, 1987-88, when much of Cake was presumably being written? Are you more, or less, self conscious? Is it easier, more difficult, different?
frank: Oh, all the bad things — harder, less natural, more self conscious… The biggest change from the early days is that it’s now much less collaborative. Cake was written together and it came together very easily. Now we don’t see so much of each other and we’re all more boring, less drunk, a bit more cautious… For me, the biggest challenge is fighting against age and the tendency to settle into maudlin music — where you’re thinking [in a sappy voice] ‘Ahhhh, that’s a nice chord’ and just making this boring music… I still like stuff with some energy. So, I’m all for returning to the jauntiness of the Cake days. Not that we could manage it — we’re all far too grizzly…
john: It has changed quite a bit for me since ’87... Then I would come up with chords or riffs and that was my limit... Then Frank would put the melodies and words to them — or Paul would have chords, or Stephen would have a middle eight idea… Gradually I started writing melodies and words as well... We have all slowly grown into songwriters — each song has usually got one main writer and someone else ironing it out or adding what it’s lacking… We all have a massive respect for each others abilities and critical faculties — and that seems to lead to what is slowly evolving into a deep, healthy, varied, personal, and very individual body of work. 'Tis a very interesting journey this Trash Cans lark…
trashcansinatras.com: Frank, you went to see The Fall play recently. What was Mark E. Smith like? Was he ranting and belligerent, or doing sort of a moody, mysterious thing?
frank: Oh, very much the latter… He was quite subdued. The bass player was a big beefcake guy with a pony tail who looked like a gladiator. It was beyond irony…
trashcansinatras.com: You’ll get no irony from The Fall.
frank: No, none at all… One of the guitarists looked like a bus driver — very grim, indeed. Then there was another guitar player who had this makeshift sort of brace on his leg. He had been maimed in some way and was just dragging his leg around behind him… The gig was okay, though. Mark was just sort of shouting phrases here and there, which, I suppose, is what you want from The Fall...
trashcansinatras.com: John, we hear you're living in London now… How's The Big Smoke treating you? You lived there for a bit, roughly 20 years ago. Any big changes?
john: I’ve been down here for almost a year now and I’m very happy, though we may move up to Scotland next year [2002]… This city hasn’t changed much since my time down here in the early 80s, though it does feel like a target since September 11.
trashcansinatras.com: You've done some gigging with Eddi Reader and Heirloom. Is that right? Details, please.
john: I played one gig with Eddi... The Tim Buckley tribute show at the Royal Festival Hall — me, her and Danny Thomson on the bass. He has played on some of my favourite records, especially the Nick Drake stuff. He regaled us with stories about [folk icon] John Martyn... A lovely man and a great experience. I’ve got this video of Frank Sinatra playing there in the late 60s — he’s introduced onstage by Princess Grace. The hall hasn’t changed since those days so it felt surreal walking out on to that stage. I’ve played a few gigs with Heirloom over the past few years. They are a fantastic band from our neck of the woods, Johnny Dillon is the singer/songwriter, and he is just wonderful:
"To see the joy in the mundane,
feel the lifeforce in the plain..."
‘To The Afton’— Heirloom
They’ve got Jamie Moir on drums and angelic harmonies and Neil Hughes (yes......of the famous Ayrshire Hughses) on the bass... Go see them. I enjoyed playing with those boys, but they were looking for a more permanent addition and I think they have found one, so you will hear more from them soon. |
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trashcansinatras.com: Frank, you’ve been doing some singing on Simon Dine’s Noonday Underground project. What are the tracks like? How does it differ from the TCS process?
frank: I’ve co-written four tracks with him, as well as singing… It’s quite enjoyable, it just sort of falls together easily. It is different than writing for Trash Cans, but I can’t really say how…
trashcansinatras.com: Do you listen to much music at home these days? If so, what sort of stuff, old or new, has been hitting the spot?
frank: I like The Strokes album. I like Super Furry Animals… I’ve got some tapes: The Jam, All Mod Cons.
john: Love and Theft by Bob Dylan hasn’t been off my stereo since it arrived. Amazing singing from the big man… Just wonderful.
trashcansinatras.com: Last time we crossed paths [in Spring 2001] TCS was decamped in Hartford, Connecticut, and seemed to be on the verge of completing album number-four, having spent the better part of a few months working on a new batch of material at Studio 45. What happened to those recordings? If they were scrapped or set aside, what led to that decision?
john: The sessions in Hartford were scrapped because we were not happy with the results... We were not a happy bunch at the time and it was reflected in the music. Listening back to the tracks now, some of it is lovely, so we will probably let some songs see the light of day, but overall it just has a dark mood…
frank: I like most of the songs, but we tried to do the recording more ‘organically’ than we have the in the past, and it didn’t really work…
trashcansinatras.com: But, on the other hand, you got to spend some time in Hartford, which some people call the ‘Paris of North-Central Connecticut…’
frank: Aye, a cherished memory…
trashcansinatras.com: The 'record biz' has changed since TCS first happened on the scene in the late 80s. Major labels today consist almost solely of blanded out divas, paint-by-numbers cartoon punk acts, and horrible 'nu-metal' troglodytes. As a result, bands of a more, shall we say, poetic bent are increasingly going the indie route — that is, signing with smaller labels and simply getting on with making records and playing to their fanbase, whatever size it may be, rather than trying to curry favor (i.e., gain a big-money record deal) from majors that probably aren't interested in the first place. Echo and The Bunnymen, XTC and The Lilac Time are but three of many recent examples of formerly ‘major label’ acts going this route… TCS fans the world over agree that the band is deserving of manna from heaven, but if no such big-label deal is forthcoming, is TCS interested in working with smaller labels? Is the art defined by the medium in which it is released?
frank: We don’t have any problem with working with a smaller label, but the fact is that there’s only so much a small label can do for you in terms of recording, tour support and promotion. So, if you’re going to be doing things on a small budget, I’m not sure what going with an indie label really does for you… It may make more sense to do it yourself and license it… There’s a couple of things in the works, so we’ll see… I would say we will definitely get a fourth album out. It’s just a matter of sorting out the details.
john: At the moment we are funding the recording of our next record partly with our own money and partly with an Arts Council grant... then the plan is to see the best way to release it… That may involve licensing it through a major or indie label or some other way... All options are open as far as how we put this next record out.
trashcansinatras.com: In closing, we heard that Paul Livingston has taken up, in close succession, gardening and running, as hobbies. Can you elucidate?
frank: Aye, I can. He tried to take up gardening and went out to the lot behind his flat to begin his planting, but he gave up… His neighbour also had a garden, containing some flourishing rhubarb, which Paul took away and made a rhubarb tart from. He was not to be denied.
trashcansinatras.com: What about the running?
frank: There’s a church at the end of the road near where he lives and he ran to that and back and things were off to a good start. The next day, he changed course and planned instead to run to the pub and turn around and head back. However, he stopped at the pub and stayed there. That was the end of that hobby, too. |
